The posting of it on this website is unfortunate, as are many of the false rumors in the comments both here and on Twitter from anonymous people. I have a feeling even if we thought there was, theres stuff going on we cant see. I initially read that as bought him years of support.Same thing I guess. Most commenters here are members of the Body of Christ there is really only one Church whether they attend HBC or not, they are part of the fellowship there in spirit. What in the world is going on? It obviously took courage for you to write it. Acts 20:17, Paul called the elders. 1 Peter 5:1, Peter exhorted the elders. It is never one individual who rules over the church, but a group of people, the elders. TX and is setting up his own consulting firm so he can go to thousands of churches setting up secret ways for enriching the head pastors. The only reason you dont want exposure is because you dont want damage to your film career. According to Titus 1:5-9 elastigirl: perhaps the other side of this coin can be the joy and happiness of discovering the magnificence of fellow human beings outside the context of christian culture. The three terms above are from the Greek language, the original language in which the New Testament Scriptures were written. Neither Dean Butters nor I wanted our letters published. Christ gave Himself for His people and that kind of sacrificial self-giving love was meant to be characteristic of those who stood in Christs place in offices of authority in the churches. Check out the Stronger Mens Conference His entire enterprise is being exposed as a fraud and a ripoff of the naive, yet he faces no repercussions inflicting so much spiritual, emotional and financial abuse. You have my phone number,. You cant change that. Im a witness that almost everything you re reading and hearing is true.. able to teach Ive seen the lightning flashing, maybe a z darn, its just the right word. TS00: there are several who have commented that attended church with JMac in his youth, and they have nothing positive to say about him or his character from way back. Turning a blind eye was a full failure. We believe that disciples of Jesus profess that He is Lord, practice His Ways, and persevere in both their profession and practice. The Bible says that one of the top competitors for our commitment to Jesus is money (Matthew 6:4). You could be the pope for all I know. A lot of people still hurt. As both Luke and Peter write, they use all three Greek terms in the same context, regarding the same office, filled by the same men. I am not saying that I am a proponent of hierarchy. I agree with those who say that Dee is fair with her control of her blog. To the American church which is playing games with the gospel in both pulpit and pew the Apostle John still shouts Come out of her, my people, lest you take part in her sins, lest you share in her plagues (Revelation 18:4). No longer do I feel like I know, or need to know, or could even remotely grasp the answers to so much of life. Christian celebrities would have no stage to perform on if they didnt have an audience willing to buy tickets. If for no other reason than to explain the rise of Christianity in an empire that opposed it. so, for sensible folks (like you and me) who actually remember the simple meaning of the gospel (the bridge built between us and God so we can know each other in real time, every day), it is only logical to assume Paul is no more unique than all the others who are part of the enormous harvest mentioned in the NT. Hall, Ive been consistent here and elsewhere under another net handle and under my actual name that I dont think the guys up to any good at all, either years ago or now. ++++++++++++++, so what? The bear was later seen using the gun to defend itself against local mice and rabbits., PASTOR has to Keep Up With The (Paige) Pattersons, you know. American believers have been forced to accept far less than God intended for us; were just too comfortable with easy-church and easy-believism that costs us nothing. He will spend years building a good rapport before gradually working toward his true agenda. Why would anyone want to kill a magnificent creature like that? ++++++++++++++++. I believe that if I hadnt been a strong donor, I would not have been considered and wouldnt have vaulted through Harvest leadership over more deserving peers in such a short period of time. With so much at stake, it can be very tempting to cut corners for the sake of what is viewed as a larger good. I guess thats why I share my story, in hopes that others can be forewarned. ), Law Prof: If we just got back to that model, the one the early church leaders generally followed . Walking in the light means not having to cover anything up and not belly aching when God Himself is the one shouting truth and revealing things from His Mountaintop. . im proud to be human. He produced the independent feature "Hometown Legend" at the age of 25 and shepherded it to distribution by Warner Brothers. The fellowship network of about 120 churches, many of which still have Harvest in their name . A defender of the weak and a rescuer of the perishing or a celebrity who gets to choose the image he parents to the world? RAWR!, I doubt that the facts will stop MacDonald from making an unrepentant comeback. He is best known as the creator, director and co-writer of The Chosen, the first multi-season series about the life of Jesus of Nazareth. of seeing the beauty of the kindness of strangers, the beauty of love and faithfulness, of integrity at personal cost demonstrated by human beings everywhere. His LLC scheme was dreamed up because James announced that no new debt would be taken on until the $43M in debt was paid off in full. They all were making out pretty large with the tithes of people who thought they were giving to good causes. The Evangelical Bubble proclaimed it a Witnessing Tool (as if that was the only reason for anything) and then bought out so many showings a lot of the theaters had to discontinue group tickets. ex HCA Staff: Im certainly not an Apostle chosen by the hand of Jesus as Paul was nor a prophet, or a son of a prophet. We see in Scripture the importance placed upon the need to have elders. The leaders of Harvest clearly did not shin light of problems; in fact it well documented now they were bullies/godfathers supressing thetruth. Vertical Church Band released four albums through Essential Records: Live Worship from Vertical Church in 2012, The Rock Wont Move in 2013, Church Songs in 2015, and Frontiers in 2016with the last two albums peaking at #1 on the Christian Billboard chart. jyjames: How to do church that has nothing to do with Jesus, then. Covidfrom the start of the pandemic and lockdowns, the Worship and Creative Teams busied themselves with recordings, writing coronavirus updates, and developing worship environments that would be both accessible and God-honoring in the height of the pandemic. Me too, back when I was in the last Bible Church. We swore our allegiance to him. In reality, if the undeniable evidence leads to the sad realization that our most beloved parent, spouse, child or pastor is not who we have believed them to be, we must be willing to deal with the facts. Just them asking me to become an elder told me something was wrong, I would say that the church you reference may have never had an ACTUAL elder then. And I doubt it was simply losing their job, as many of them voluntarily left. They act like the real problem is that they messed up in a technical way. Didnt Paul rejoice from prison that the gospel was preached, whether from false motives or true? Or would they even care? You were part of a workforce which brought a feeling of camaraderie and purpose and fellowship. David, this is something that I think needs much closer examination. It's God who opens doors, but we must walk through them. We meet every Sunday in-person. Im convinced that an antinomian spirit has taken control of some ministries, where church leaders feel they have been released by grace from the obligation of observing the moral law. Craig French: Thanks for confirming the authenticity of the content, Dallas. We all know who is trustworthy, mature and wise to go to for advice or counsel. Our '3rd Service' is an online experience drawn from our live Weekend Gatherings. john, i truly suspect that the only difference between my friends & family i described above and the grace-filled believer you describe is window dressing: vocabulary used when speaking, a smiley face, a tone of voice, body language. Jesus talked a LOT about living in the Kingdom we would do well to read His words living in the church doesnt always mean living in the Kingdom. This will always happen, there is no way to avoid it. And your Father who sees in secret will reward you. Shes gone after him more than most. More Campus News . I read your posts as a searing, agonized, utterly sincere *cri de ceour. Thats why the early church had congregational governance, rather than elder rule polity the Body of Christ had a say in who the church leaders were. Of course it does require set up of chairs, nursery area, etc., and the take down every week and people who are committed to doing that. What we have is countless people cutting him some slack . No more indulgences. It was given to the elders two months ago. You will find that many commenters have been on similar journeys, who share stories of pain and disillusionment with their church experiences. Thus, I try to insert IMO where applicable. THis man should never be in a position of authority again, and even less in one of spiritual authority (whatever that may mean). For you, maybe, but not for most here. He was also a member of a team at the Harvest Bible Chapel. Many will say to Me on that day when I judge them, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in Your name, and driven out demons in Your name, and done many miracles in Your name? And then I will declare to them publicly, I never knew you; depart from Me, you are banished from My presence, you who act wickedly disregarding My commands. (Matthew 7:21-23). Jimmy & Gateway Sr Lead Pastor Robert Morris are two of only three Elders over Mark Driscolls church. Dan Claassen Living in what the people of Chicagoland call "the northwest suburbs" theologian Scot McKnight and his daughter, teacher Laura Barringer had a front row seat when things began unraveling at Harvest Bible Chapel and Willow Creek Community Church, and furthermore were acquainted with many of the people who became a part of our daily Twitter and blog feeds about both stories. In the entire New Testament, the word only turns up once in the singular, 4th in a list of 5 useful gifts or roles (not official offices, near as I can tell) in Ephesians 4. You cant express truth sufficiently in religious teachings and traditions; it can only be found in a relationship with Christ. He relocated here from another state to marry my daughter, and pastors a small mainstream church that has been struggling to keep its doors open the past few years. TS00: what are these things you see in such people that you identify as being grace-filled? Power provides for itself and money and sex. Backfired twice over. I was really hoping I would find that this was a much later development. For one of his theatrical performances at HBC shortly before his demise, JMac posed as a homeless man to make a sermon point I suppose he was so relevant, you know. And I have collaborated with Ryan and Jessica, among others, throughout this. You also have no idea what else is happening. Hours . I pray that God will continue to use you to shine a spotlight on wicked works of darkness in Christendom today. He added the promise of millions of dollars in renos and expansions, via the Closer Campaign, in order to sweeten the pot. Just let go of the reins, lil woman, and submit to your God-given, masculine authorities . Robert Morris sits on the Board of Driscolls new church or at least he did Driscoll no longer lists Board members on his new website. and the thought of gathering up ones gumption and taking risks is tiring. If a church tries to appoint elders who dont meet the qualifications for eldershipthe church dies. Prison that the gospel was preached, whether from false motives or true ones gumption and taking risks tiring!, masculine authorities and traditions ; it can only be found in a relationship with.... Where applicable & Gateway Sr Lead Pastor Robert Morris are two of only three elders Mark! These things you see in Scripture the importance placed upon the need to have elders if didnt! Religious teachings and traditions ; it can only be found in a relationship Christ!, theres stuff going on we cant see rejoice from prison that the gospel was,. 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